A question for those of you who do process serving...

[chrisr]

Have you ever come across subbies who are so unhappy to be being served with process that they try to cause a problem?

By cause a problem, of course, I mean throw a punch or otherwise act like a peanut.

Haven't had this too often myself.. but interested to see what your experience(s) has been.

I think about this sometimes... as (at least, in NSW) we are in an odd position - the Sheriff's Office is a government business effectively in competition with us (insofar as they charge fee-for-service for serving court documents), but unlike us, they are armed, and we're not. If they get in the biff, they can lawfully have (and use) PPE to protect themselves.. not to mention the training they get in how to use those nifty toys.

We, however, can't (unless you hold a weapons licence which is almost impossible to get).

What kind of incidents have you found yourself in, and how have you dealt with them?

[Jockey]

Hi Chris and a great topic. I have found the key to a successful service is politeness and good communication with the person you are serving. Human nature and common sence is that the person served will react to your attitude and what you say. If your rude and abrupt, you will put them on the back foot from the start. I always treat people on how I would expect to be treated. Many years agoi was introduced to a 22 rifle by the person I was trying to serve with an ultimatum in which I replied that the lawyer can deal with it as I didn't need the trouble and walked back off the property with papers in hand and watched till I drove away. Once around the corner I rolled the papers up with rubber bands on each end, waited 5 mins then drove back passed the address tossing the papers over the roof of my vehicles (ex paper boy) hitting the wire door then kept driving and sworn the affidavit accordingly as I previously identified the defendant.

[chrisr]

.. Many years agoi was introduced to a 22 rifle by the person I was trying to serve with an ultimatum in which I replied that the lawyer can deal with it as I didn't need the trouble and walked back off the property with papers in hand and watched till I drove away. Once around the corner I rolled the papers up with rubber bands on each end, waited 5 mins then drove back passed the address tossing the papers over the roof of my vehicles (ex paper boy) hitting the wire door then kept driving and sworn the affidavit accordingly as I previously identified the defendant.

Quite a disturbing situation to come across, and a good way to resolve it. Can't say I've had the pleasure of anything so dramatic.

My former sister in law is a sheriff's officer and she's come across some real loonies trying to serve documents, and on more than one occasion she's been set upon (despite taking the right attitude and care to avoid it) and had to defend herself with her baton and spray..

[Jockey]

No matter how good or nice youare. you will always come across someone that will just re act to being served. One thing I do as an advantage is to start helping and advising them their rights to defend a matter, which changes the tone straight away with the person saying I know your just the server and it's got nothing to do with you. A lot of process servers un fortunately see people being served in courts on tv programs by identifying the person then telling them there served. This practice in real lifeis really not the way I would do things or you can expect to be verbally abused or jacked up by the person. As I stated previous, the approach is important for the reaction and sometimes it doesn't matter how pilite you are.

[chrisr]

A lot of process servers un fortunately see people being served in courts on tv programs by identifying the person then telling them there served. This practice in real lifeis really not the way I would do things or you can expect to be verbally abused or jacked up by the person. As I stated previous, the approach is important for the reaction and sometimes it doesn't matter how pilite you are.

That's really good advice. When I started doing this, early on I spoke to a solicitor and got the good oil on minimum requirements, and unsurprisingly, they gave similar advice to you.

First thing is to check their identity, can't really get around that, and you shouldn't be telling them much if they're not your subby. As a practice, I then introduce myself as a process server, identify the other party, and explain that I am here to give them some important documents. Depending on the nature of them, I try to give some basic advice about what they can do with them.

E.g. for a civil matter where I'm serving a plaint, I tell people they usually have a right to defend the matter, and they should speak to a solicitor or the court about how to do that. For family law matters, I explain that nothing has happened yet, this is just the next step in the process. If I can get them to sign an acknowledgement of service (even though it's not always required) I do so, and introduce it as an exhibit to my affidavit of service.

It's all about approach. If you're nice and up front, without being a dickhead, people rarely have an issue with you - you're just a middleman. The only time I really have issues is where people have been deliberately avoiding service and they get cranky that they've been found (e.g. when approaching people outside their workplace).. but even then, they usually just accept it. Failing that, drop the docs at their feet, tell 'em they should read these documents, and walk off. Problem solved.

[Jockey]

When serving a civil matter I always ask for the person by the first Christian name. Once they say yes that's me....I then go through the procedure with the I'd of there full name. Why do I do it that way is because I want them off guard. If I am to official from the start with certain people it triggers an alarm... Who is this what do they want ect as well as the gives the person a chance to ask me questions before I can properly identify them. In most cases if someone comes to the door you answer and say hi is Chris home please. More than likely they reply. Yes mate that's me. What what I do for you. Ect

[Joaldrew]

Hi,

I agree with all above.  I have found that if you look official and speak official from the get go, it gives them a chance to put up their protective wall, and from there can get dirty pretty quick!

I have gone the casual way, and so far haven't had any problems.  also if they have a bad reaction you still need to remain casual and calm, if you react to their reaction everything escalates from there, and it will be hard to control the situation once that happens.

Jo

[chrisr]

I have gone the casual way, and so far haven't had any problems.  also if they have a bad reaction you still need to remain casual and calm, if you react to their reaction everything escalates from there, and it will be hard to control the situation once that happens.

True enough. Gone are the days where it was relatively easy for a commercial agent to get a weapons permit to carry a baton under your shirt in case someone took a swing at you.

These days.. about all you can do if someone arcs up is try to de-escalate verbally, and failing that, cut and pissbolt and hope they don't give chase.

One would hope to avoid these situations through the application of skill and reason in the first place.. but sometimes that just doesn't work.

I had an interesting conversation with the NSW firearms registry not long ago (they do weapons licensing as well as firearms) and basically they won't issue permits to anyone for this kind of thing. Even after a fairly lengthy (yet friendly) conversation about the disparity between persons doing the same kind of work, there didn't seem to be any give.

E.g. a security guard patrolling a shopping centre (a lower risk activity) can get a permit (and in many cases, doesn't actually need one), sheriffs and bailifs are exempt from permits and yet a subset of their duties are completely identical to what process servers do... and yet process servers can't (anymore..) get the same kind of protection.

T'was an amusing discussion.. reminds me of the good ole days where things were far easier and the laws weren't so distrusting of honest individuals :/

Sorry, I'll stop reminiscing

[BigGeorge]

Ah, great thread, love a nice yarn
 

While we're at it, let me relate that around 1977 with two years under my PI belt I had to serve documents on a farmer. I was as green as could be, but figured I was cool and able to handle this. The farmer was on a property about half an hour west of Roto, NSW (look it up!). I got across the grid of his property and drove for about fifteen minutes to get to an air field where I was told the farmer can sometimes be found. This was still within his property. His homestead was another five miles inland. Anyway, the farmer turned up in his ute which had a gun rack in the back with three rifles on it. The man was as big and as rough as I've ever seen and barked at me what did I want. Little old me was of course cunning, having wrapped the subpoena inside a map. I asked him to point me to a place and that way stood next to him, whilst he held one end of the map and I the other.

Like a very smooth operator (not) I revealed the subpoena, gave him the formal speech and pushed it against his hand (the rules in them days was that it had to touch the person).

Imagine the stupidity and naivety of this cool PI!

I was alone in the middle of nowhere with a big grumpy farmer who could have shot me and buried me, which no one would ever know because we might as well have been a million miles from nowhere. No mobile phones back then, nothing.

As it were, the fellow turned out to be good natured, said no worries mate and shook my hand as I departed in my city slicker van. I was lucky, but too stupid to realise just how lucky I was.


BG

[Homer]

I used to do doorknocks of residential areas canvassing for witnesses republic liability claims. Hardly anyone spoke to me until I started wearing an orange safety vest while taking photos, measurements and doorknocking etc, then everyone was as nosey as they could be and more than happy to chat. Maybe wear a vest when doorknocking ? Jockey - would that help with process serving ?

[chrisr]

I used to do doorknocks of residential areas canvassing for witnesses republic liability claims. Hardly anyone spoke to me until I started wearing an orange safety vest while taking photos, measurements and doorknocking etc, then everyone was as nosey as they could be and more than happy to chat. Maybe wear a vest when doorknocking ? Jockey - would that help with process serving ?

That's a cheeky idea wearing a safety vest while door knocking. I like it and will give it a try

[Jockey]

I don't think so Mark I recon that would agrevate them. I like serving people that are avoiding service because I annoy the shit out of them and I won't go away. I end up getting a call from their solicitor to except on there behalf or I like to follow them when they leave and hit them in a shopping centre or leave them under the windshield wiper. Luckily I don't get a lot refusing service of late.

[Darren]

Interesting points re PPE while process serving.
In Victoria I am licenced to carry a firearm, handcuff and baton - but to do so while conducting process serving would soon see my licence revoked. Laws certainly seem strange at times - you can only carry to protect valuables but can only use to protect life. So next time you see a celeb wearing a $600,000 necklace it may not always be there just for show! :wink:
Seriously, unless any PPE was completely covert, I suspect it could actually aggravate the situation at times when process serving.

Regarding the process serving, I've had little problem and as others have said it is usually your approach that can make the difference. Jockey's idea re using christian names works well and reminds me of one particular serve which had me a bit anxious.

I was on the way over with the documents to serve and only then learned that the respondent had a huge rap sheet - including various drug, assault and attempted murder charges. The premises was known to be inhabited by at least 10 others with similar histories. On arrival (mid afternoon on a weekday) the front door was wide open and at least 15 unsavory types were wandering about everywhere, one saw me approach and met me at the door. "Hi, I have a delivery for Bill", I said. There were now 5 at the door, one of which turned to another and said, "Bill, a delivery for you". As bill arrived I said his full name as I handed him the envelope, "Yes" he said. "I just need a signature", I said as I passed him a pen and held the clipboard with the acknowledgment of service. As he was signing I listed the documents (which were also listed on the acknowledgment), by the time he finished signing I said, "thanks, have a nice day". He responded, "you too mate" as I turned and walked away. The client and their legal team were surprised enough that the documents had been served - let alone that a signature had been obtained. I'm sure had I turned up in a suit and tie trying to be official things would have been quite different.

In contrast other services where you expect no problem can go the other way, but knowing the law and where you stand, identifying and reacting to problems, plus varying the approach to suit can assist in getting it done. Remember once identified it's quite easy to leave it in their presence - (although I haven't personally used the paper boy method above) :lol: